Up@dawn 2.0

Friday, February 23, 2018

Quizzes Feb 27, Mar 1

This isn't on Exam #1, but we'll begin discussing it Tuesday if time permits.

LH 4-5 [Note: we're skipping LH 3, on skepticism, for now. We'll come back to it next class.]

1. According to Epicurus, fear of death is based on what, and the best way to live is what?

2. How is the modern meaning of "epicurean" different from Epicurus's?

3. What famous 20th century philosopher echoed Epicurus's attitude towards death?

4. What was the Stoics' basic idea, and what was their aim?

5. Why did Cicero think we shouldn't worry about dying?

6. Why didn't Seneca consider life too short?

FL 21
7. By the end of the '50s how much TV did the average American watch?

8. Who was the Steve Jobs of his era?

9. Of what was Disneyland "more or less a replica"?

10. What fantasy did Hugh Hefner promote?

11. Who was our "ad hoc national Pastor-in-Chief"?

DQ:

  • Are you afraid of death, of dying, or of any other aspect of human mortality? Why or why not? What's the best way to counter such fear?
  • Are you epicurean in any sense of the word?
  • Have you experienced the death of someone close to you? How did you handle it?
  • Do you believe in the possibility of a punitive and painful afterlife? Do you care about the lives of those who will survive you? Which do you consider more important? Why?
  • Do you consider Epicurus's disbelief in immortal souls a solution to the problem of dying, or an evasion of it? Do you find the thought of ultimate mortality consoling or mortifying?
  • How do you know, or decide, which things you can change and which you can't? 
  • Were the Stoics right to say we can always control our attitude towards events, even if we can't control events themselves?
  • Is it easier for you not to get "worked up" about small things you can't change (like the weather, or bad drivers) or large things (like presidential malfeasance and terrorist atrocites)?  Should you be equally calm in the face of both?
  • Who had the better idea about why we shouldn't be afraid to die, Epicurus or Cicero?
  • Do you waste too much time? How do you think you can make the most of the time you have?
  • Is it possible to live like a Stoic without becoming cold, heartless, and inhumane?


Quiz March 1
DR 13

1. In the Hellenistic period Western philosophy came to be seen as what? What did the Hellenistic philosophies all praise, and what did they all see as the key to wisdom?

2. Of what later philosophy was Epicureanism the main ancestor?

3. What central problem of philosophy was Epicurus apparently the first to state?

4. From what did the Stoics take their name?

5. What was the one thing the Stoics thought the Epicureans were right about?

6. How does Gottlieb say the Stoics were inconsistent?

FL 22
7. Where was the New Age philosophy/lifestyle invented?

8. What central New Age tenet did Jane Roberts "channel," and from whom?

9. What "sudden and enthusiastic embrace" helped turn America into fantasyland?

10. What bestseller whose popularity announced the mainstreaming of fantastical beliefs did Andersen's mother read?




The Ancient Greek philosopher Epicurus was born in 341 BC, on the island of Samos, a few miles off the coast of modern Turkey. He had an unusually long beard, wrote over three hundred books and was one of the most famous philosophers of his age.

What made him famous was his skilful and relentless focus on one particular subject: happiness. Previously, philosophers had wanted to know how to be good; Epicurus insisted he wanted to focus on how to be happy.

Few philosophers had ever made such a frank, down-to-earth admission of their interests before. It shocked many, especially when they heard that Epicurus had started a School for Happiness. The idea of what was going on inside was both entirely shocking and deeply titillating. A few disgruntled Epicureans made some damaging leaks about what was going on in the school. Timocrates said that Epicurus had to vomit twice a day because he spent all his time on a sofa being fed luxurious meats and fish by a team of slaves. And Diotimus the Stoic published fifty lewd letters which he said had been written by Epicurus to some young students when he’d been drunk and sexually obsessed. It’s because of such gossip that we still sometimes now use the adjective ‘Epicurean’ to describe luxury and decadence... SoL

What is the best life we can live? How can we cope with whatever the universe throws at us and keep thriving nonetheless? The ancient Greco-Roman philosophy of Stoicism explains that while we may not always have control over the events affecting us, we can have control over how we approach things. Massimo Pigliucci describes the philosophy of Stoicism...Ed.ted



‘Stoicism’ was a philosophy that flourished for some 400 years in Ancient Greece and Rome, gaining widespread support among all classes of society. It had one overwhelming and highly practical ambition: to teach people how to be calm and brave in the face of overwhelming anxiety and pain.

We still honour this school whenever we call someone ‘stoic’ or plain ‘philosophical’ when fate turns against them: when they lose their keys, are humiliated at work, rejected in love or disgraced in society. Of all philosophies, Stoicism remains perhaps the most immediately relevant and useful for our uncertain and panicky times... SoL
DQ
  • What do you think of when you hear the word "therapy"? Do you think philosophers can be good therapists?
  •  Do you think "the greatest happiness of the greatest number" is an appropriate goal in life? Can it be effectively pursued by those who shun "any direct involvement in public life"?
  • If the motion of atoms explains everything, can we be free?
  • Is it true that your private thoughts can never be enslaved?
  • Do you agree with the Stoic critique of Plato's Forms? (321)
  • How do you distinguish things that are and are not subject to your control?


Book of Life: Epicurus
==

Old posts-
Pyrrho, Epicurus (LH); WATCH:Epicurus (SoL); Epicurus on HappinessLISTEN: Epicureanism(IOT); Epicurus the greatest philosopher? (IOT). Podcast
Quiz Sep16
  piranha

1. (T/F) Extreme sceptics (skeptics, in the USA) like Pyrrho thought it best to avoid holding firm opinions on anything.

2. The point of moderate skepticism (unlike Pyrrho's extreme version) is to get closer to what? 


3. (T/F) Epicurus said it's reasonable to fear death. 

4. (T/F) "Epicurean" originally meant someone who indulges in luxury and sensual pleasure. 

5. What 20th century philosopher had a view of death similar to Epicurus's?

6. Epicurus's attitude will be unlikely to work for you if you believe what?


DQs:

1. Do you find it comforting or troubling to assert and identify with strong opinions?

2. "Don't believe everything you think." Good advice? What should you believe? How should you decide what to believe?

3. Do you fear death, or dying, or oblivion? Why or why not? OR, Do you agree that death is not an event to be experienced in life?

4. Do you have any expensive tastes? If so, how do you satisfy them? If not, is that because your time is worth more to you than anything else?

5. Nigel says it's a mistake to think there will be something of us left to feel whatever happens to our dead bodies. Agree or disagree? Why?


6. Can you really imagine what it would be like to continue existing after your heart stops? Can you describe what you imagine? What's your basis for that description? Are you threatened by the fact that not everyone believes in a supernatural afterlife? What about a natural afterlife?
==

Pyrrho reminds me of the Ruler of the Universe

...who is really more Pyrrhonist Skeptic than solipsist, I think.



MAN:   Pussy pussy pussy . . . coochicoochicoochi . . . pussy want his fish? Nice piece of fish . . . pussy want it? Pussy not eat his fish, pussy get thin and waste away, I think. I imagine this is what will happen, but how can I tell? I think it's better if I don't get involved. I think fish is nice, but then I think that rain is wet so who am I to judge? Ah, you're eating it.

I like it when I see you eat the fish, because in my mind you will waste away if you don't.

Fish come from far away, or so I'm told. Or so I imagine I'm told. When the men come, or when in my mind the men come in their six black shiny ships do they come in your mind too? What do you see, pussy? And when I hear their questions, all their many questions do you hear questions? Perhaps you just think they're singing songs to you. Perhaps they are singing songs to you and I just think they're asking me questions. Do you think they came today? I do. There's mud on the floor, cigarettes and whisky on my table, fish in your plate and a memory of them in my mind. And look what else they've left me. Crosswords, dictionaries and a calculator. I think I must be right in thinking they ask me questions. To come all that way and leave all these things just for the privilege of singing songs to you would be very strange behaviour. Or so it seems to me. Who can tell, who can tell.
. . . .
MAN:   I think I saw another ship in the sky today. A big white one. I've never seen a big white one. Only six small black ones. Perhaps six small black ones can look like one big white one. Perhaps I would like a glass of whisky. Yes, that seems more likely.
. . . .
Perhaps some different people are coming to see me.
. . . .
MAN:     Hello?
FORD PREFECT:    Er, excuse me, do you rule the Universe?
MAN:     I try not to. Are you wet?
FORD:    Wet! Well, doesn't it look as if we're wet?
MAN:    That's how it looks to me, but how you feel about it might be a different matter. If you find warmth makes you feel dry you'd better come in.
. . . .
ZAPHOD BEEBLEBROX:  Er, man, like what's your name?
MAN:       I don't know. Why, do you think I ought to have one? It seems odd to give a bundle of vague sensory perceptions a name.
ZARNIWOOP:  Listen. We must ask you some questions.
MAN:    All right. You can sing to my cat if you like.
ARTHUR DENT:  Would he like that?
MAN:   You'd better ask him that.
ZARNIWOOP:  How long have you been ruling the Universe?
MAN:   Ah, this is a question about the past is it?
ZARNIWOOP:  Yes.
MAN:    How can I tell that the past isn't a fiction designed to account for the discrepancy between my immediate physical sensations and my state of mind?
ZARNIWOOP:  Do you answer all questions like this?
MAN:    I say what it occurs to me to say when I think I hear people say things. More I cannot say.
. . . .
ZARNIWOOP:     No. Listen. People come to you, yes?
MAN:  I think so.
ZARNIWOOP:    And they ask you to take decisions—about wars, about economies, about people, about everything going on out there in the Universe?
MAN:    I only decide about my Universe. My Universe is what happens to my eyes and ears. Anything else is surmise and hearsay. For all I know, these people may not exist. You may not exist. I say what it occurs to me to say.
ZARNIWOOP:  But don't you see? What you decide affects the fate of millions of people.
MAN:    I don't know them, I've never met them. They only exist in words I think I hear. The men who come say to me, say, so and so wants to declare what we call a war. These are the facts, what do you think? And I say. Sometimes it's a smaller thing. . . .
. . . .
MAN:    But it's folly to say you know what is happening to other people. Only they know. If they exist.
ZARNIWOOP:  Do you think they do?
MAN:    I have no opinion. How can I have?
ZARNIWOOP:  I have.
MAN:   So you say—or so I hear you say.
. . . .
ZARNIWOOP:  But don't you see that people live or die on your word?
MAN:    It's nothing to do with me, I am not involved with people. The Lord knows I am not a cruel man.
ZARNIWOOP:    Ah! You say . . . the Lord! You believe in . . .
MAN:    My cat. I call him the Lord. I am kind to him.
ZARNIWOOP:  All right. How do you know he exists? How do you know he knows you to be kind, or enjoys what you think of as your kindness?
MAN:    I don't. I have no idea. It merely pleases me to behave in a certain way to what appears to be a cat. What else do you do? Please I am tired.
. . . .

Note: This philosophical dialogue is excerpted from the final scene of the original radio series The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy.  This sequence can also be found in chapter 29 of the novel The Restaurant at the End of the Universe, with more narrative description and slightly expanded dialogue.
==

Here's something completely different: a cartoon view of Aristophanes' fable in Plato's Symposium:

24 comments:

  1. #8
    -Are you afraid of death, of dying, or of any other aspect of human mortality? Why or why not? What's the best way to counter such fear?

    I'm not really afraid of death. We know it's going to happen, why fear it?

    -Have you experienced the death of someone close to you? How did you handle it?

    I've experienced the death of three of my grandparents, the fourth passed before I was born. I was young so I didn't really understand what was going on.

    -Do you believe in the possibility of a punitive and painful afterlife? Do you care about the lives of those who will survive you? Which do you consider more important? Why?

    I think there can be a painful afterlife if the person's not lived a good life. I would definitely care about the people I leave behind.

    -Do you consider Epicurus's disbelief in immortal souls a solution to the problem of dying, or an evasion of it? Do you find the thought of ultimate mortality consoling or mortifying?

    An immortal soul is different from an immortal human. If people lived forever, that is mortifying. However, immortal souls is not scary.

    -How do you know, or decide, which things you can change and which you can't?

    You can't. Deciding something can't be changed automatically puts a halt to any progress achieved. I don't think anything should be viewed as a constant.

    -Were the Stoics right to say we can always control our attitude towards events, even if we can't control events themselves?

    Yes, I think that's true.

    -Is it easier for you not to get "worked up" about small things you can't change (like the weather, or bad drivers) or large things (like presidential malfeasance and terrorist atrocites)? Should you be equally calm in the face of both?

    I feel as though getting worked up isn't a solution to a problem. A person should be calm in all cases, soft to speak and slow to anger.

    -Do you waste too much time? How do you think you can make the most of the time you have?

    I feel as though many of us do. It's hard not to when there's so much going on, especially as college students. Sometimes, we just need to take a step back and relax.

    ReplyDelete
  2. #8
    DQ's
    1. I'm not afraid of death because their is no point in being afraid of something that you know will happen.
    3. My grandma died when I was 10 and I didn't actually ever cry until her visitation and her funeral. She was the only grandparent that I really knew.
    4. I don't know what will happen to me when I die. I would definitely care if I left behind some impact on the people that I knew and that survived me.
    5. I think it is an evasion of it . We all die no matter what. I find it consoling because no will necessarily have a much longer life than someone else.
    6. The only things that you can change are the things that happen to you.
    7. Yes, someone can feel happy about an event but something may happen and they may begin to dislike the event. You have absolute control over your attitude.
    8. I try not to get worked up over little things because I'd like to save my time for something more important or life changing. If someone cuts me off, I'll get mad for a few seconds and try to remind myself not to get mad over something so small in life.
    9. I believe Epicurus had the better idea.
    10. I occasionally do feel like I am wasting my time on things in life. We all have felt like things are a waste of time.

    ReplyDelete
  3. #3
    DQ:
    1. Are you afraid of death, of dying, or of any other aspect of human mortality? Why or why not? What's the best way to counter such fear?
    No because I know where I am going after I die. I think knowing where you are going counters that fear.

    2. Are you an epicurean in any sense of the word?
    I like the finer things in life but I do not live that way.

    3. Have you experienced the death of someone close to you? How did you handle it?
    Yes, and it was hard. I did not take it well.

    4. Do you believe in the possibility of a punitive and painful afterlife? Do you care about the lives of those who will survive you? Which do you consider more important? Why?
    Yes, if you do not believe in God then I believe you will end up in Hell. I do care about others and I do not consider more important than the other.

    5. How do you know, or decide, which things you can change and which you can't? 
    I think it depends on how hard you are willing to work.

    6. Is it easier for you not to get "worked up" about small things you can't change (like the weather, or bad drivers) or large things (like presidential malfeasance and terrorist atrocites)?  Should you be equally calm in the face of both?
    I think so because you cannot do anything about it. I think it is hard to be calm.

    7. Who had the better idea about why we shouldn't be afraid to die, Epicurus or Cicero?
    I think Cicero because I also believe that the soul lives forever.

    8. Do you waste too much time? How do you think you can make the most of the time you have?
    I think I do I think spending time with my family is how I like to make the most of my time.

    9. Is it possible to live like a Stoic without becoming cold, heartless, and inhumane?
    I think living like a stoic would just be a new way to live I do not think you have to be cold and heartless.

    ReplyDelete
  4. #8
    Discussion Response
    Have you experienced the death of someone close to you? How did you handle it?

    - I have. At first it was hard to take in because it was an accident and not expected. Initially i had feelings of regret; i wished that i hadn't gotten so busy and spent more time with this person. Then i tried to look at the positive side. I was thankful for all the time we had spent together growing up. I considered that the years as kids and throughout high school that we had together could've been the best years that we ever would've had together. Maybe had nothing happened, we still wouldnt have spent much time together anymore. It made me value friendship more, i think i also tend to tell people i love them more often now. In a way, i believe it reminds you not to take life for granted. If from what happened, i learned to cherish time with others more, it might hurt a little less next time i lose someone close.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. #8
      That's a great way of looking on the bright side!

      Delete
  5. #8 Alternative Quiz Questions

    FL 21
    1. When was playboys first issue?
    2. Who was known as the king of beats?
    3. During Walt Disneys Childhood, where did Americas three world
    fairs take place?
    4. How long did Billy Grahams LA Crusade last?
    5. When Disney Land opened, how many thematic parks where there?

    LH 4-5
    6. According to Senneca, how should we spend our time?
    7. Who did Epictetus inspire with his view of being stoic during
    the Vietnam War?
    8. Followers of Epicurus had taken notes on some of his
    teachings. How were some of the fragments of scrolls
    preserved?
    9. About how many books do records suggest Epicurus had written
    on rolls of papyrus?

    ReplyDelete
  6. #8
    "Are you afraid of death, of dying, or of any other aspect of human mortality? Why or why not? What's the best way to counter such fear?"
    Most my life mortality has been a fear of mine. As I grow older I realize how insignificant life would be if one happened to obtain immortality. The cycle would never end and room for new life would never open. The fruits of life aren't everlasting in themselves either. I believe experience does have to an extent a limit for some people.

    ReplyDelete
  7. #8
    "Are you epicurean in any sense of the word?"
    I like luxurious things but i've lived most of my life without them. I'd say I'm a very loose interpretation of the word.

    ReplyDelete
  8. #8
    "Have you experienced the death of someone close to you? How did you handle it?"
    Yes. Every emotion flourished through my soul. But i could still feel them in my heart. So i was able to cope with that feeling.

    ReplyDelete
  9. #8
    "Do you consider Epicurus's disbelief in immortal souls a solution to the problem of dying, or an evasion of it? Do you find the thought of ultimate mortality consoling or mortifying?" I think it's more of an evasion because as of now there's no way to obtain the ultimate answer. But if there's truly nothing after death then that sounds pretty mortifying.

    ReplyDelete
  10. #8
    "Were the Stoics right to say we can always control our attitude towards events, even if we can't control events themselves?"
    That seems like a pretty accurate statement.

    ReplyDelete
  11. #8
    "Do you waste too much time? How do you think you can make the most of the time you have?"
    I certainly waste time. But ultimately there's a lot of time we're forced to waste anyway. Whether it's waiting to be called at the DMV or waiting for something to download, sitting in traffic, sleeping, etc. But the time that isn't to be wasted I am certainly capable of making the most of it.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. #8
      I agree with you that we are sometimes forced to waste time.

      Delete
  12. #8
    "Is it possible to live like a Stoic without becoming cold, heartless, and inhumane?"
    Absolutely, you don't have to act out your beliefs or thoughts at all times.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Aldair Avalos Madera10:29 AM CST

    #8
    1.) Are you afraid of death, of dying, or of any other aspect of human mortality? Why or why not? What's the best way to counter such fear? No, I'm not afraid of death because it's just the way of life. You can't live a happy, healthy life if you're constantly worried about dying because the reality of things is that everyone is dying, some faster than others. So, you can't be afraid of it.
    2.) Have you experienced the death of someone close to you? How did you handle it? Yes I have, I handled it pretty well. I allowed myself to be sad about the fact that they're gone forever. However, I was also happy because they were done suffering from everything and all of their worries had come to and end.
    3.) How do you know, or decide, which things you can change and which you can't? I actually don't think you can ever know what things you can and can't change, but I do believe that if you really decide to change something then it will change for the better or the worst, but you can change it.
    4.) Do you waste too much time? How do you think you can make the most of the time you have? I do believe I waste too much time, but I think I can make the most of my time by being happy and not worrying about things I can't control and just let life happen and work on making my life better.

    ReplyDelete
  14. #8
    March 1st DQ's
    1. I think of therapy as trying to help someone with a mental issue. Philosophers can help with someone's mental state but not to the full extent as an actual therapist.
    2. I think everyone should strive for their happiness and do what they want to accomplish in life.
    3. I think we can all be free but to a certain extent. we have certain laws and regulations that helps our freedom not get to out of hand.
    4. I think they can't because they are yours to have.
    5. No I don't agree with him.
    6. If you can change them and influence them then you have control.

    ReplyDelete
  15. 1. I am not afraid of death, although I don't particularly want to die any time soon. Death is inevitable, so worrying about it only takes away from the quality of life.
    2. I have experienced the death of a close friend and a childhood friend. I dealt with this by saying out loud that they were gone, so that I could come to terms with it.
    3. I believe the lives of others around me are more important.
    4. The things that you can change are very limited, and I think it's good to always keep that in mind.
    5. I believe it's a solution. The idea of mortality is terrifying and comforting at the same time.
    6. I think they were definitely right.
    7. You should be equally calm in the face of both, but I find it easier to stay calm during large conflicts than small ones.
    8. I definitely waste too much time. I should schedule my days ahead of time to make the most of them.
    9. I think of the movie the Sixth Sense. I think philosophers can make great therapists.
    10. I think it's a great thing to strive towards.
    11. I'm not sure if we as humans can ever be "free."
    12. I believe your private thoughts can only be enslaved to themselves.

    ReplyDelete
  16. #3
    1. I'm not afraid of death, or dying. However, I think for most people that has a lot to do with whether they are religious or not. The best way to counter that fear is to have something to believe in or knowing death will eventually come for everyone so there is no reason to be afraid of it.
    2. I have experienced the death of someone close to me. It was very painful and difficult to handle but I found the best way to do so was to spend a lot of time with friends and family and also to just mourn them, but know that they are in a better place.
    3. I am personally not certain that there is a painful afterlife, and I do care about the lives of those that will survive me and in a sense think that others lives are more important than mine, because they have the possibility to do more with their lives for the future if they survive me.
    4. I wouldn't say it is a solution but more of an escape to not think about what comes next or rather not to fear it. Mortality is a scary thought, but it can also be consoling for those who may be suffering or in severe depression. It can also be a reason to push ourselves more and try harder since we know our lives will eventually come to an end.
    5. I know that I can't change things of the past and can't necessarily change what other people do but I know that I can change what I do and I can't help but think that will somehow affect what someone else does. Therefore, changing what someone else does.
    6. I believe the Stoics were right because no matter what we can always control our attitudes towards things even if we can't control the event that is happening to us or around us.
    7. I think I get more worked up about large things just because I know I can't change it in the slightest bit because I am only one person. However, with smaller things I feel like it is easier for me to control my anger because it is a small thing and doesn't affect a large amount of people like a terrorist attack would. I do think I should be equally calm in the face of both, but being who I am I don't think I ever could.
    8. I definitely waste too much of my time, but I think I could make the most of it by beginning with getting better sleep at night. If I did this then I wouldn't be as tired all the time and would then have the motivation to do more with my time rather than sleep it away.
    9. I think it is possible to live like a Stoic and not become cold, heartless, and inhumane because those are all things we can control ourselves therefore they can be prevented.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. #8
      I agree with your first discussion question response. I think that is a great way to counter it.

      Delete
  17. #8
    Alternative Quiz
    DR 13
    1. How come Socrates thought a good man could not be harmed?
    2. What did the Stoics claim was the point to inquiry?
    3. What did the Sceptics claim was the point to inquiry?
    4. How many phases were there in the 500 year development of
    Stoicism?
    FL 22
    5. Who was the Harvard professor that handed out Psilocybin and
    LSD to students?
    6. Not long before Esalen was founded, the main co-founder
    suffered a mental breakdown and was involuntarily admitted to
    a psychiatric hospital. How long was he there for?
    7. Whose meditation technique was called perfect knowledge?
    8. Tom Wolfe wrote an essay in the New York Magazine that was
    remebered for coining what term?

    ReplyDelete
  18. #8
    Discussion Response
    What do you think of when you hear the word "therapy"? Do you think philosophers can be good therapists?

    - When i hear the word therapy i think of someone needing a
    guidance, someone to rant to in hopes that theyll have some
    second opinion or words of advice. I think some philosophers
    would make good therapist. I think philosophy can help people
    understand themselves more and the world around them.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. #8
      I totally agree with your response. That is what therapists do, which can be applied to philosophy.

      Delete
  19. #8
    -What do you think of when you hear the word "therapy"? Do you think philosophers can be good therapists?

    I feel as though philosophers could be good therapists because they'll ask questions about life and try to understand the meaning behind peoples' actions or thoughts.

    -Do you think "the greatest happiness of the greatest number" is an appropriate goal in life? Can it be effectively pursued by those who shun "any direct involvement in public life"?

    I think it can still be pursued.

    -If the motion of atoms explains everything, can we be free?

    Yes we can be free, we are composed of atoms and we move as we please. The explanation of movement doesn't restrict us.

    -Is it true that your private thoughts can never be enslaved?

    If they're in your mind, then they're in your mind only.

    -How do you distinguish things that are and are not subject to your control?

    I feel as though even if things seem out of your hands, you still have some sort of control.

    ReplyDelete
  20. #8
    "What do you think of when you hear the word "therapy"? Do you think philosophers can be good therapists?"
    I think of therapists as paid advice givers or an embodiment of tricks and tips. They might be loosely related to philosophers.

    ReplyDelete

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