Up@dawn 2.0

Thursday, March 21, 2013

"Torture, Boo!" H-01 Group 3

Today the Philosoraptors had the pleasure of discussing the ideas and beliefs of Alfred Jules Ayer, an English philosopher that was influenced by David Humes contemplations on metaphysics as well as the early 20th century bore with metaphysics: If the sentence was neither true by definition nor empirically verifiable (or falsifiable), then it was, Ayer declared, meaningless. As simple as that.

 




The Philosoraptors thought that Ayers philosophy shared many characteristics with Pyrho's skepticism blended with Stoicism. For example, the sentence "My room is full of invisible angels that leave no trace."  seems to mean something, but Ayer's point was that it contributed nothing whatsoever to human knowledge, though it might sound poetic or could possibly contribute to a work of fiction. The sentence literally had no meaning to Ayer: it sounded like nonsense. Technically the sentence is grammatically correct and false; however, Ayer would claim to not even understand. A sentence is gibberish unless it is either 1) True by definition or 2) Empirically verifiable.

But Ayer applied his dogma to more than just metaphysics: religion and morality were subjected as well. One of his most challenging conclusions was that moral judgements were literally nonsense. This seemed like an outlandish thing to say, but it was what followed if you used his two-pronged test on moral statements. So through Ayer's perspective, saying "Torture is wrong"  is equivalent to "Torture, Boo!"
 
 When you say "Compasion, is good" all you are doing is showing how you feel: it's just like saying "Compasion, Hooray" It's a complete statement of opinion and not true by definition or empirical verification. Not surprisingly, his theory, known as emotivism, is often described as the Boo!/Hooray! Theory. The Philosoraptors thought this principle had almost no practicality because if this moral standpoint is taken, there would be no way to have organized society due to the lack of ethicality: there would be no social contract to keep everyone safe because people could do what they see fit and have no following consequence.

Another interesting tidbit of information is Ayer's religion. He is igtheistic: that special category of people who think that all talk of God existing or not existing is complete nonsense. Howeverlater in life, when he chocked on a bit of salmon bone and choked to the point of death, he had a vision while is heart had stopped beating. It was of a red light and two 'Masters of the Universe' talking to each other. This vision didn't make him believe in God, but it did make him question whether the mind could continue existing after death.

In the end, Dr. Oliver mad an interesting point on A.J. Ayers rogress as a philosopher. His youth was filled with firery disownments of all the great philosophers and their urbbish, but after his near death experience, he developed a sense of compassion towards other peoples beliefs, although still retaining is igtheistic standpoint.

-Jake

7 comments:

  1. I honestly do not agree with Ayer's standpoint on how a sentence is not true if it is not verifiable or true by definition. I think this has something to do with the trust issue. Sometimes you have to trust people you know whether or not you know it will be the best or for the worst. I think it has to do with how well someone knows the other person. Also, I do not believe that sentences/different topics have to be true definition to be worthy of being talked about. I think everything is essential in life that we learn. I think we should not disregard the sentences or events that happen that are not under Ayer's guidelines. I believe everything has its purpose in life, and Ayer was wrong about how he critiqued everything under his two definitions of what should be considered and not.

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  2. I mentioned it in class, but I really like Ayer's view of God--we'll never know if it's true or not, so why are we even talking about it?

    I agree with Evan in that "sentences/different topics have to be true definition to be worthy of being talked about. I think everything is essential in life that we learn." We all learn from our debates of whether or not we are debating what is essentially true. And, if we spent all our time trying to decide if what we were talking about was WORTH being talked about, we'd never talk about anything of substance!

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    1. I'm a bit confused by your comment. Evan said he does not believe things have to meet Ayer's requirements to be discussed. Is that what you think also? Can you elaborate a bit more on your point? Thanks!

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  3. Ayer, Boo!

    I can see that Ayer was tired of philosophers sitting around thinking about "metaphysical things", so he created a way of verifying whether subjects were worth his time. Here is where I agree with Evan. Not only strictly true/false topics are worth our time. I think that somethings we have no way of deciding for fact their validity, like things such as morals and social standards. These more personally subjective topics we get "truth" from somewhere else, than using a mathematical proof format and smacking QED at the end.

    FQ: What where Ayers two questions?
    DQ: Purpose an idea why Ayers reaffirmed his position after his near death experience (in a way that is very different than the majority of near death experiences that are reported)

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  4. It's ironic how, as Little History points out, that Ayer's theory defeats itself in that it does not fulfill its own requirements.

    I think we should be wise in our assessment of ideas that are presented to us, but I do not thnk it is helpful to completely discount an idea because it does not meet requirements that you arbitrarily created. How in the world do you know your "Idea Requirements" are reliable? You don't. Exhibit A: Alfred Ayer. I don't think we should put limits on the true-ness of ideas until we have actually discussed them. As Aristotle said, "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."

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  5. Evan, I was really interested in how you brought up trust. It comes back to what are our definition of what it means to know something. Can we know that someone loves us? Can we know that there is purpose to life? By Ayer's definition of knowledge, we can't know these things. Yet are they worth our time? I think so.

    Matthew, I agree that we probably learn more if we approach everything as an opportunity to learn, rather than discounting something up front. However, I think this applies to God as well.

    FQ: T/F Albert Camus used the Greek myth of Sisyphus to explain existentialist's view on the meaning of life.
    DQ: How do you find purpose in your life? Is it something you build, from within yourself, or it something you find, outside yourself?

    Link: For a change, here's a link to a song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PKF1-JtAIY). It's kind of a reflection upon my discussion question. Also, it's part of why I feel Christianity can never simply become a social institution for moral reform, because that's not what it is about.

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  6. I agree with everyone's posts. Trust is something we can't "know", but we all depend and trust people; we know there are certain things we can trust (I KNOW that my family loves me, for example). Ayer had a lot of good ideas, but, perhaps like most of the philosophers we read about, I think they took their own ideas too seriously. Ayer takes empiricism to the extreme of not listening to anything that he believed not to be worth his time. Aristotle's rule of the Golden Mean is a suitable compromise in my opinion, because we should always try to decide if information is worth our time, but we also need to listen to what other people say; if just for the sake of hearing another point of view.

    DQ: Is God worth discussing if there's no tangible evidence to say yay or nay?

    FQ: Who started their philosophy at the end of the second world war?

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